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VOTE: Store Manager - Stay or Go? Rate Topic   - - - - -

Poll: What do you want done with the Store Manager? (1 member(s) have cast votes)

What do you want done with the Store Manager?

  1. Remove the Store Manager - Implement a Web-Based Upgrade Script (66 votes [67.35%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 67.35%

  2. Keep the Store Manager, I need it! (11 votes [11.22%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 11.22%

  3. Never used it / Cannot use it (Linux / Mac / ETC) (21 votes [21.43%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 21.43%

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Posted 12 October 2007 - 05:44 AM #1

This is NOT A HELP THREAD.

As we may all be aware there are some issues with the "Store Manager" that is required to be used prior to upgrading CS-cart stores.

This thread is a poll which features three choices.
1. Removal - Implementation of Web-Based script
2. Keeping the store manager
3. Never used it / Cannot use it (Linux / Mac / ETC)


Please make your decision carefully and if needed explain your decision.
This is not a flaming thread, if it doesn't work just a sentence will do explaining why. We want CS-Cart to read this thread looking for advice rather then seeing a wall of flame.

Please bare in mind the following:
I have no power to state whether it will be staying or going.
So don't flame me if anything happens to the store manager in the future.

Jesse
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  • jobosales
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Posted 12 October 2007 - 06:48 AM #2

I really think it is best to use a web-based script like every other php-based script I have used does. This offers the broadest coverage for usability and makes it easier for members to assist one another. As pointed out by S-Combs (I think), it also avoids potential problems related to server security.

I could also have chosen option 3 since we are moving Macs. We still have some Windows machines and could also run Windows (either under Boot Camp or emulation), but our goal is to run a Mac/Linux shop.

Bob
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  • tletourneau
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Posted 12 October 2007 - 07:50 PM #3

If store manager worked correctly I'd be all for it :cool:. That said a server side script should, as mentioned, make support easier by somewhat limiting the number of variables. I appreciate that the system shows the changed files but we know going into a mod that it will be wiped by an upgrade. Unless someone happens to be a programmer it doesn't make sense to allow us to keep changes that may make the system unstable. I'd rather have to redo any mods I want to keep after the upgrade and have a stable system from the start than try to integrate untested mods directly into a new upgrade.
Thanks,
Tom
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  • Lorian
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Posted 14 October 2007 - 04:21 PM #4

I hate the Store Manager with a passion - the sooner it gets ditched the better IMO.

Despite multiple attempts on different platforms for different stores owned by different clients I have never once had it work. I have given up with it totally - every upgrade so far has been achieved only by completely reinstalling the cart.

A web based upgrade script would be 100x better.


L

 
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Posted 15 October 2007 - 09:02 AM #5

yes, you have to remove the store manager it always gives the error while upgrading your version. I have done the upgrade by using manual method. ;)
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Posted 16 October 2007 - 07:19 PM #6

this is official pool ?

 

Posted 17 October 2007 - 02:14 AM #7

this is official pool ?


Not Offical. Mentioned that in the first post :rolleyes:
It's going to be our main goal to attempt to pursuade cs-cart to drop the store manager as it's next to useless at the present moment. A noble feat for many however webscripts are much easier to maintain/use and don't create security issues of such
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Posted 17 October 2007 - 07:51 AM #8

Hey Jesse, how hard would it be for someone with programing knowledge to make their own webscript ?

 

Posted 17 October 2007 - 08:02 AM #9

Hey Jesse, how hard would it be for someone with programing knowledge to make their own webscript ?


Piece of cake from what I gather.
I could proberly gurantee that if 5-6 people from the forums felt like experimenting I'm sure they'ld get somewhere quickly.

I've created manual upgrade instructions on cs-developer.com (re-created) however it's not specific for all people so that's where a script would work better.
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Posted 17 October 2007 - 02:55 PM #10

It's not a simple process to make a quality PHP upgrade/installer system Jesse and, it does require knowledge of all changes made between the versions (more so that simple file comparing). It would be possible for some of us to do this but nobody is able to freely invest the required time to create this each time a new version or service pack is released.

The first step of this would be to create a standard template for the upgrade/installer system. This would be a base to build all future versions of it. Upon launching, it would check current version, system settings, database connection and file/directory permissions. It would then inform you of any problems found or ask whether to make a fresh install or upgrade if no problems were found in the tests.

The fresh install option would be very simple since that is already incorporated so no need to talk about that here. The upgrade option however requires much planning and more work. Since not everyone who wishes to upgrade to the latest version will be running the same version, it will be neccessary for the system to decide the steps required to perfom the upgrade to the current build based on the version checking in the previous steps.

Since this is an actively developed script there will be service, bug or security releases offerred within each build (SP1, SP2, SP3, etc). To simplify the upgrade process with so many different builds, I suggest the following proceedure similar to how the vBulletin forum software handles the same issue.

Each new version of cs-cart will require a seperate upgrade script from the most recent version (ex: 1.3.4-sp3 to 1.3.5). As newer builds are created these previous upgrade scripts will remain unchanged and a new one created for the new build.

The upgrade script will determin what version the client is currenly running then select the next version upgrade file to run. After that file completes successfully, it will move onto the next upgrade file (if required) and so on until the installed version is the same as the current release.

------------------------------------------------

Here's an example of what an install/upgrade directory would look like if this method was adopted...

cscart/INSTALL/

.   install.php
.   upgrade.php
.   install_functions.php
.   1.3.2-to-1.3.3-upgrade.php      (Would only need created once)
.   1.3.3-to 1.3.3-sp2-upgrade.php               "
.   1.3.3-sp2-to-1.3.4-upgrade.php               "
.   1.3.4-to-1.3.4-sp1-upgrade.php               "
.   1.3.4-sp1-to-1.3.4-sp2-upgrade.php           "
.   1.3.4-sp2-to-1.3.4-sp3-upgrade.php           "
.   1.3.4-sp3-to-1.3.5-upgrade.php               "
.   1.3.5-to-1.3.5-sp1-upgrade.php               "

------------------------------------------------


I'm sure some clients are still running version 1.3.3 or below so some backtracking should be done to create the upgrade files between those earlier builds.

The best thing about this method is; Once these upgrade files are created they never need edited again. You just include them to future releases and modify the new upgrade.php to include them when needed.
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Posted 17 October 2007 - 03:15 PM #11

Store manager must go... and heres my reasons why !

(excuse if these repeat any others but thats what its all about)

CS-Cart is not dependant on windows.. Store Manager is !
CS-Cart works.. Store Manager doesnt !

Is there really anything more that needs stating ??
[SIZE=3][/SIZE]

 
  • Degsey
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Posted 24 October 2007 - 12:20 AM #12

Store Manager worked for me first time without any hitches.

I could have done it manualy as I have done with other shopping carts that I have used in the past, this was way tooo easy.

Please keep it as it makes the job easy .

Degsey

 
  • S-Combs
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Posted 24 October 2007 - 12:41 AM #13

Yeah it probably worked like a champ on your CubeCart store :P
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Posted 24 October 2007 - 01:20 PM #14

Yeah it probably worked like a champ on your CubeCart store :P


Look at http://www.mrpcdirect.co.uk

Probaly it is because of my extensive experience on modding cubecart that I can make the store manager work, I also work with mods on oscommerce as well.

You know perhaps cubecart could benefit from a store manager:rolleyes:

Degsey

 
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Posted 24 October 2007 - 10:23 PM #15

Look at http://www.mrpcdirect.co.uk

Probaly it is because of my extensive experience on modding cubecart that I can make the store manager work, I also work with mods on oscommerce as well.

You know perhaps cubecart could benefit from a store manager:rolleyes:

Degsey


Well, thats a completely stock / standard cart with sample products..
You could have just installed it fresh as far as I can tell. I have modded the h*ll out of CS-Cart, doesnt mean Store manager will work, I mean... you cant really mod the code in store manager now can you lol !

Show me a customised store upgraded with store manager !!! Im talking skin, products, mods the lot ! Like most stores should be, not a base default skin
[SIZE=3][/SIZE]

 
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Posted 24 October 2007 - 10:56 PM #16

Actually it was not a completely stock store that I upgraded, it had 3 mods in it and I did it tounge in cheek without backup to see if it would upgrade without loss or damage.

I actually lost 2 mods and retained one on the upgrade.

I agree with your sentiments if the store was modded to hell then Store Manager will not be an effective means for an upgrade.

The way that cs cart is put together it is meant as a turnkey operation for the majority of its buyers so that the store manager is the best way to upgrade for them.

I am still playing around with cs cart as an option for the future, its a great store with lots of features. The drawback is the way the skinning works on it and the cost and lack of thirdparty designers and variety of skins.

Degsey

 
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Posted 29 October 2007 - 03:57 AM #17

It's just ridiculous what Store Manager puts you through even for the slightest upgrade patch. You THINK you're BACKING up to be safe, but it actually backs up an unusable backup file which is corrupt!

 
  • russ1106
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Posted 02 November 2007 - 03:47 PM #18

Yes, lose the store manager. Its horrible. I prefer web based upgrade as well. The manual upgrade killed me.

 
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Posted 06 November 2007 - 12:13 AM #19

I think cs cart's intentions were good with store manager
they tried to make an application that would newbies could use

they should have stuck to something that was tested and worked
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Posted 08 November 2007 - 04:27 PM #20

I've never tried Store Manager, I've moved all my skin changes manually each time I've upgraded as the cs-version of my current store is currently strictly local and still in progress while I'm slowly learning the needed skills to mod it to match my manually generated store.

I have modded the h*ll out of CS-Cart...
Show me a customised store upgraded with store manager !!! Im talking skin, products, mods the lot ! Like most stores should be, not a base default skin

This is where I'm at. My store looks absolutely nothing like a standard CS template ... template files are HIGHLY modded. I'm modding some of the functionality (checkout process, etc.), have added a number of variables per category or product, and have completely changed the way CMS functions are handled as a work-around for a couple of other issues that would require expensive mods and are apparently very specific to my way of doing things. It's a great piece of software, but it simply doesn't meet my needs "out of the box".

I don't think any automated upgrade utility will ever work for me in all honesty. What I need is a highly sophisticated compare tool that knows the changes made from one version to another, and that highlights those changes ONLY where they occur in my modded file. From what I've seen, most changes are along the lines of:

<a tiny piece of code> replaced by <a new tiny piece of code>
<a line of code> replaced by <a new line of code>
<a block of code> replaced by <a new block of code>
<code deleted> or <code added>

It would seem to me that this level of comparison should be possible and would be a huge help for custom shops. Strictly comparing my modded file to the upgraded file highlights my changes mostly, lumped in with changes between versions. A compare tool that referenced both the old version original file and the upgraded version original file to identify version changes, then showed where those changes occur in my modded file would be HUGE. Any changes I have made could be ignored by this tool, just point out the changes made by CS where they occur in my file on a line or snippet level, tell me when something is missing as I may have eliminated it or modified it so it isn't recognizable. Then allow me to approve each change, or edit manually so I can preserve any changes I've made.

I currently use Fcompare, but it has limits .. I have to 1st compare the original files to id the changes, then find the changed code in my modded file and make the change manually. This approach would greatly benefit by further removing formatting (tables, embeded styles, etc.) from CS templates. The changes made to a "more" CSS driven templates system in 1.3.5 were a huge help.