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Share your ideas about the future of CS-Cart at UserVoice Rate Topic   - - - - -

 
  • brandonvd
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Posted 28 February 2010 - 08:19 AM #21

just let us know about your needs so that we could pick your favourities and put them on our roadmap for the upcoming months.


So, how does this work exactly. One addon that is important to me is the deal the the day addon. As of writing this it is in second place with 37 votes and 17 people interested in it.

I'm sure that a lot more people are interested, but since the ideas section is new they probably haven't seen it or haven't been able to vote on it.

So does it take a certain amount of people to vote before it is just added to the next version?

We are currently trying to raise funds for this addon. If there are enough people voting on this and we raise enough funds are you just going to add in the addon even though a select group of us paid to have it developed?

I know that you can say that by us paying for this addon and then you including it in the next version would be the best for the community, but it isn't very fair to us who paid to have it developed.

Anyway, if you could please clarify how your voting process works I would really appreciate it.

Thank you,

Brandon

 
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Posted 28 February 2010 - 05:51 PM #22

Brandon-

I was surprised to see this mod added to the UserVoice area for the very reasons you mentioned. By adding it to the the UserVoice system, you are saying that it should be implemented in the cart:

You can post your suggestions regarding the new features/improvements which you would like to have and vote for things you would like to see in future versions (so that CS-Cart could be developed basing on your opinion, not just ours!)


Although it is easy to argue that including paid mods in future versions for maintainability is a good idea, I think it is also reasonable that people who pay for them have exclusive rights for a while - it is hard to say how long because CS-Cart also needs to respond to competitive pressures.

Since this is being pursued as a paid mod which would give it higher priority than any crowdsource input, the votes for this mod are essentially wasted unless you guys do not go forward with the paid mod.

Just my thoughts.

Bob
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Posted 28 February 2010 - 05:58 PM #23

Brandon-

I was surprised to see this mod added to the UserVoice area for the very reasons you mentioned. By adding it to the the UserVoice system, you are saying that it should be implemented in the cart:


Although it is easy to argue that including paid mods in future versions for maintainability is a good idea, I think it is also reasonable that people who pay for them have exclusive rights for a while - it is hard to say how long because CS-Cart also needs to respond to competitive pressures.

Since this is being pursued as a paid mod which would give it higher priority than any crowdsource input, the votes for this mod are essentially wasted unless you guys do not go forward with the paid mod.

Just my thoughts.

Bob


I was thinking along the same lines. I sorta view this as unless, you guys & gals absolutely need this mod very soon, your probably better off to just let it run it's course thru the UserVoice system.
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Posted 28 February 2010 - 06:06 PM #24

I was thinking along the same lines. I sorta view this as unless, you guys & gals absolutely need this mod very soon, your probably better off to just let it run it's course thru the UserVoice system.

In general, if you need a mod urgently, pay for it. If you can wait, then add it to the UserVoice system. This is really the same as adding feature requests to the Bug Tracker with the benefit that it is easier to identify the breadth and depth of interest.

Bob
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Posted 28 February 2010 - 06:52 PM #25

You guys understand my points than.

I am happy to pay for this addon especially how we are going about it. I would really like to have this addon and don't want to wait months and months for it to be released.

What I am concerned with is if we pay CS-Cart almost $800.00 for this addon and it is in the ideas section with a lot of votes, we'll just see it in the next version. I'd hate to pay a bunch of money to have this developed just to see it out free to everyone else a month later.

Maybe I'm being a selfish little baby about this, but I would sure like some clarification from CS-Cart about this.

Brandon

 
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Posted 28 February 2010 - 07:11 PM #26

What I am concerned with is if we pay CS-Cart almost $800.00 for this addon and it is in the ideas section with a lot of votes, we'll just see it in the next version. I'd hate to pay a bunch of money to have this developed just to see it out free to everyone else a month later.


Hello Brandon,

Yep, that is the part that truly sucks about buying any custom mod, you never know when your idea was such a good one that it might showup in the core release at a maybe not so distant time down the road. But then again, it may not show up for years, if ever! It's a ****shoot dude!

But then again, there are also benefits when something like this is added to the core & in turn maintaned by the developers thru future upgrades, so there are pros & cons.

To me it is all about how bad do I need a particular feature, or how long I can afford to wait for it to be added! For example, we need some serious shipping improvements made which are truly costing us a substantial amount of change every day, so I am obtaining quotes right now & even if these improvements are added to the core in a couple months down the road (and I hope they truly are), our cost savings over 2-3 months will pay for this mod.
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Posted 28 February 2010 - 07:29 PM #27

Oh, I think that the addon would be great to just be added into the future releases. I just hate having to pay out cash for something that will be just given away later. I guess I am kind of a cheap bastard on that one.

The daily deal addon isn't truly necassary for my business. I can definitely get a long with out it. The way we are going about having it developed though helps spread the costs out and makes it so that it is something that is an affordable extra feature.

I'm just hoping that CS will clear some stuff up that's all.

By the way, you confused the hell out of me on one of your other posts. What do you mean by "girly girl"? I know that I didn't put an girl's name on the tank I sent you. (By the way, how do you like it?) Now I am just confused on who I'm talking to. I thought you lived in Indiana, not San Francisco.

Brandon

 
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Posted 28 February 2010 - 07:36 PM #28

What do you mean by "girly girl"? I know that I didn't put an girl's name on the tank I sent you. (By the way, how do you like it?)


LOL, I was just messing with Jesse abit, I'm a real dude......... :D

The Frugal Edge is awesome, I mounted it under my tv in the entertainment center and it makes a nice fit! Thank you very much!

I am hoping Frugal comes out with a bigger version, like a 30 gal or something like that in the future!
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Posted 28 February 2010 - 07:36 PM #29

Maybe I'm being a selfish little baby about this, but I would sure like some clarification from CS-Cart about this.

You are certainly not being selfish. I think Struck covered the pros and cons pretty well. For me, personally, I think it is an advantage for things to be incorporated into the cart both for maintainability and for the marketing advantage it provides to CS-Cart (something which benefits all of us long-term). That said, I think where possible (i.e., market conditions do not dictate otherwise), paid mods should not be folded into the cart in a month or two.

One of the biggest advantages of the UserVoice system is the limited votes each member has - it forces people to really think about which ideas are important to them. I think the biggest downside to those who voted for this idea and are also paying for the mod is that their votes could have been used to advance other issues which are not being paid for - money is the ultimate uservoice.

Bob
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Posted 28 February 2010 - 11:28 PM #30

One addon that is important to me is the deal the the day addon. As of writing this it is in second place with 37 votes and 17 people interested in it.

We are currently trying to raise funds for this addon. If there are enough people voting on this and we raise enough funds are you just going to add in the addon even though a select group of us paid to have it developed?


The "deal of the Day Addon" will most likely be cancelled by the club and donations will be returned. It's extremely sad that 41 people will vote for this addon yet only 3 are willing to pony up the donations to get it developed. If all 40+ people who voted for the addon donated to have it coded it would have only cost $25 out of pocket each, is that too much to ask?

Same goes for the ebay addon, we have 47 votes but had only one generous donation to get the addon coded by the club, it's another fine example of everyone expects everything for free. Despuite the uservoice system their are far more important issues thta need addresed and added to the cart like the The Deal of the Day Addon which is more important to the cart then ebay/amazon addons which should be sold separately by CS as addon package.

The cart will start tanking when dozens of addons are added that only a minority of users use. Addons are great but it's really time for usability issues to be addressed which have been ignored for a long time.

The data feed manager can already export products to ebay and amazon formats, however it can't re-important back for inventory purposes ect...

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Posted 28 February 2010 - 11:56 PM #31

Sno-

I agree with you but it is important to note that the 'Deal of the Day' add-on has 19 supporters (not 41) as of this moment - still that would require only a $45 donation.

One of the advantages of the UserVoice system is that you can weigh breadth of interest against depth of commitment. I think that CS-Cart should focus on items with great breadth as these affect many customers. This includes addressing the many usability issues, many of which have been sitting in the Bug Tracker for ages. The problem is that many of those affected do not even take the time to vote which surrenders control to the vocal few (myself included) - so far, I am disappointed by the response in the UserVoice system. Have they sent an email informing all license holders of the new system?

I also think they need to clarify the distinction between the Bug Tracker and the UserVoice area. I think only feature requests should go into UserVoice and only bugs should be reported in the Bug Tracker from this point forward. I also wish they would implement a better bug tracking system (e.g., Mantis) which could provide a better idea of what is being worked on and when the issue is targeted for release, as well as other benefits if the developers decided to take advantage.

Bob
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Posted 01 March 2010 - 03:38 PM #32

Well I asked CS-Cart about this through the helpdesk. Honestly, I feel the "ideas" thing is a crock of **** and basically a place for us to go whine and be ignored by CS-Cart.

Anyways, I asked:

I've got another question for you.
You guys created the "ideas" section on the forum for us users to post our ideas and vote on them. My understanding is that if these ideas get enough votes than you will integrate them into future releases of CS-Cart.
Currently the Daily Deal addon is in second place with 42 votes and 20 supporters.
How does the idea section work exactly? Does it take a certain amount of votes to make the addon part of CS-Cart?
What I am concerned with is paying you $760.00 to develop this addon and then because of how popular it is, you end up just putting it into the next version of CS-Cart for free for everyone else.
I feel that this addon would be a great benefit to CS-Cart and it would be nice if it was just added without us having to pay you a bunch of cash to develop it.
If you could clarify the ideas thing a little more I would sure appreciate it.


Alexander responded with:

This is a new feature that is supposed to provide us with information about customers most wanted additions. All ideas posted on the forum will be given serious consideration. However, we cannot guaranty that new ideas will be implemented into the standard CS-Cart package.
Practically this new section is added as a better alternative for customers that request new standard features through this customer help desk system.
Moreover, at the moment we do not plan to include the current addon into the standard implementation in the nearest future.
Also please note that new standard addons are developed from scratch by our architects in order to optimize the process and to allow to change them with minimal conflicts in the future.


Well, there you go I guess. While the votes do carry weight, it's not like once a idea gets x amount of votes it will get developed or anything. It's just up for "consideration" which means they are still only going to do what they want.

Brandon

 
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Posted 01 March 2010 - 07:57 PM #33

Well, there you go I guess. While the votes do carry weight, it's not like once a idea gets x amount of votes it will get developed or anything. It's just up for "consideration" which means they are still only going to do what they want.

Brandon-

I think the developers goal is to get the feature requests out of the Bug Tracker so that it is less cluttered - basically, anything in the Bug Tracker should be given a higher priority than new features. This is consistent with the many calls here in the forum to fix things before adding things.

To be fair, I think you also need to compare the tools for establishing priorities in the UserVoice system against the existing Bug Tracker system. In the Bug Tracker, it seemed somewhat random which feature requests were addressed although some were pushed through based on popular consent. The UserVoice system simply formalizes this - making it easier for customers to voice their opinion and clearer to both developers and customers what additions are most desired. That does not mean that the developers will (or even should) take votes as the sole consideration for inclusion. For instance, which should be considered more important - 30 people casting 3 votes each for a project or 50 people casting 1 point each for a different project? The fact is, it may make more sense to meet the broader need that a more specific need.

There are other considerations , as well. I believe there are many small usability improvements that would greatly improve the out-of-box experience; I suspect many people using the trial simply get frustrated setting up the basics and move onto something they find easier to use. I doubt many existing shopowners would advocate for these changes, but they represent not only the lost initial sales of the software but also the lost opportunity to sell maintenance contracts and custom programming. Project sequencing is another factor - do I start working on something I know is going to be affected by changes in the near future (e.g., do I setup that 100G tank this weekend in my den that I am planning to remodel next month)? Then, there is also the consideration of time/resources - if I have 5 programmers available, it may make sense to put only 2 on one project that will take a couple of weeks but assign the others to projects which can be accomplished fairly quickly. To be successful, the developers will need a mix of these items to best utilize their resources and I think that is where the ability to judge breadth and depth will prove valuable.

I see the UserVoice system as a means to help set milestones for the next couple of iterations of the cart with better collection and collation of input from customers. Whether or not it works well will depend on the customers casting their votes and seeing how the developers respond in the next couple of releases after 2.0.13 which I am guessing is pretty locked-down at this point.

I guess I am saying I am just more optimistic of how this will work out. We really won't know for a while.

Bob
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Posted 02 March 2010 - 12:24 PM #34

Now not only license owners but also active forum users (having ten or more posts during the last 30 days) who registered over 30 days ago can vote for features.